The Charles-Diana relationship.

[Earl Grey]

I have followed BP-Writers advice about this because I felt it needs its own thread. In this way, we can discuss Charles activities without mentionning his private life every time.
Maybe some of the mods could move the relevant post in the squirrel-thread to this new thread?

Disclaimer:
-I have stated in three posts already that I think adultery is wrong. so stop saying am defending it. what amazes me is that charles continues to get bashed because of Camilla, while other famous men (known to have affairs, for example ex-president Clinton) can still be (reasonably) popular.

[sandy]

It's not only cheating. Charles could have had a few one night stands but he went into a marriage under false pretenses, knowing he didn't love his bride and wanting to have his mistress around. I always thought he was trying to "break Diana in" pre engagement by having her in proximity to the Parker Bowleses and passed them off as his "friends" and CPB as his "safe Friend".  Charles never spelled out to her what her "role" was in the marriage (ceremonial purposes and providing heirs), and Diana thought he was madly in love with her and really would "forsake all others."

Also it is compounded by an apparent lack of remorse and self justification on Charles' part--the spin that DIana was "mad" came right out of Charles' camp. He blamed EVERYONE but himself for his marital collapse when all he had to do is look in the mirror. I doubt he and Camilla are the least bit sorry, Charles had his cake and ate it too. I think he believes his own spin. The Dimbleby book is based on Charles' own beliefs and it clearly shows he tried to justify his own bad behavior.

I think he has a cruel streak. I wonder if he will be pictured "offing" gray squirrels.

[sandy]

Clinton publicly apologized (to the people and to his family) for his indiscretions. When did Prince Charles apologize?

Charles has a spin team that tries to "justify" his bad behavior which shows a lack of remorse on his part. Fatty Soames, Charles' pal said Diana was "paranoid." His cousin Lady Mountbatten said Diana was "damaged." Charles sympathizers blame Diana.

Charles marrying his mistress who was hugely instrumental in breaking up his marriage was unprecedented in royal family history. Charles naming his mistress publicly was also unprecedented.

Diana was hugely popular and is now dead. Had Charles behaved honorably and dumped Camilla I think Diana would be with her boys and be alive today.

He cut Diana loose and he didn't work hard on his marriage.

By the way, Clinton DID get criticized for his behavior and even Mel Gibson is not being "praised" for the way he is acting now. John Edwards political career is in effect OVER because of his cheating. Elliott Spitzer had to step down as governor for cheating with a prostitute. NObody gets off scot free with adultery. Why should Charles?

Camilla plotted and schemed to get where she is today. Why should she be "universally" adored. Charles ruthlessly pushed his first wife away. Why should he be seen universally as this "beloved" figure.

[Lily of the Valley]

Nobody can ever say that if Charles had dumped Camz, Diana would be alive. It is impossible to tell. However, I think the marriage would have fallen apart anyway, there were more problems than just adultery (although that was bad enough), neither of them were suited for the other person.

I think we have to move on though. I know it is hard because he was horrible to Diana and so was Camz, and I'm not saying we have to support them or even like them but it happened so long ago, I feel that we have to let it rest. Diana died and I wish she hadn't but shouldn't we remember all the good things about her life instead of all the bad things that happened to her? I think we should focus on the two lovely Princes she and Charles had, or all the good work both of them has done.

[sandy]

I think that however much the Palace want people to "move on" Diana will not be forgotten. Nor will Charles actions.

Frankly I think it  a cop out to say the marriage would have "failed anyway." It think without the "safety net" of Camilla that Charles had it WOULD have succeeded. It would have taken WORK and it wouldn't have been easy. BUt I think if Charles had put some effort into his marriage they could have worked something out. Charles ditched Diana after harry was born very early on in the marriage. He had Camilla around undermining things and calling the shots. Some even said she advised Charles NOT to have more children with Diana and he went along with it.

It's not Past History what Charles and Camilla did really tore down the rep of the monarchy and forever lowered the bar.

Marriage is not trying on a pair of shoes then saying they don't fit. Marriage requires work and more work. I think Charles and Diana could have come to some understanding had Camilla not been around.

I think Camilla would be every new bride's ultimate nightmare.

And Charles being a true husband to Diana would IMO have greatly lessened the chances of Diana being in that Paris tunnel on August 31, 1997.

[bpwriter47]

sandy,

not sure who you are directing all this too, but I think all Too and I were stating is that because Charles was a jerk in the way he treated Diana doesn't mean he hasn't done some good.  we both have shown we didn't like what he did and don't believe in adultery.

I've been through the exact thing Diana went through except I stayed faithful in my first marriage until I could not take it or wouldn't take it any longer.

  My ex was a jerk in the way he treated me , married me while still seeing this woman and then eventually divorced me to marry her and they put me and my boys through hell for years, leaving me with nothing but debt.

But, I can say he was really good at his job and although he was there physically for my boys, he has in the last 4 or 5 yrs. become a much better emotional father and so I couldn't take that away from him because he was a stupid man who had an affair. They are 2 separate things.

We don't appreciate what Charles did, I hate it personally.  But I can't say everything is bad about him. 

I think you misunderstand us. We don't like charles that much, we hated what he did to diana; but many people who have gone through his charities have been helped by him.  At least that, he should be recognized for. 

We all make some really bad choices in life at some point, but if everyone judged us only on that mistake, it would be a horrible life. 

Erm....PM me on the lazer thingy!!!   

[sandy]

I don't think Charles was all that great a father. Sure, he loved his sons and they love  him. But I think he neglected Harry who developed substance abuse problems when Charles  left him alone at Highgrove. I also think that Diana would have worked with Harry who perhaps could have attended Uni with her guidance (I understand Harry is dyslexic).

Also bashing their mother and having his pals and sympathizers do it for him was just plain tacky (and he could have made his sons' mother non negotiable).

Had he taken the high road after she died I would have had more sympathy but I thought it was downright nasty to condone the "Diana was mad" bashing. Obviously many didn't buy into it but he tried just the same.

Charles shenaniigans also lowered the bar on royal consorts. With Camilla being let into the fold and divorce now more an option than when Charles first married, this could open the floodgates for continued broken marriages and marrying one's mistress.

Let's say WIliam marries and is dissatisfied he can think well Dad got a divorce and I can always have this option.He would think he doesn't have to try very hard he can always get out of it like Daddy did. And when he's through with his wife, going ahead and marrying  his mistress.

This sort of behavior was not done before Charles.

[bpwriter47]

Clinton only apologized after he claimed he didn't have sexual relations with that woman because she had the proof...the stain on the dress.  He would have never apologized if she never had proof.

LoV..

[sandy]

Yes, but he still apologized. Charles lied about his involvement with Camilla as more than a "friend" for as long as he could get away with it and APB would go along with it. His tape made the exact nature of the relationship obvious and his pals didn't say anymore DIana "imagined it". The capper was Charles admitting he slept with Camilla BUT he never apologized to the public nor his wife and family. Instead in his authorized biography he pointed the accusing finger of blame on Diana, his parents--everyone but himself. Clinton expressed regret over his transgressions in his autobiography. HUGE difference.

[Uriel]

I doubt William would do such a thing, on more than one occassion its been stated that he's terrified of making the wrong choice and having to get a divorce like his parents, he doesnt want to end up like them by making the same mistakes, he wants to do things right, it's one of the reason I think he dithers with Kate.

[bpwriter47]

Well, I agree with what you said on Charles, but Clinton was about to be impeached...I would have apologized also even if I hadn't done it!!  Clinton was cornered and I never expected Charles to apologize, he's not a President fighting to keep his job. 

Now, this is not defending Charles, there's a difference, just saying that if Clinton could have gotten away with it (like JFK and many others did), he would have.  He expressed regret because he didn't want to be impeached.  If they had no proof on him, he would have NEVER admitted to it. 

[sandy]

Clinton is still married to his wife. They managed to work something out. He did apologize to her no matter what the circumstances an apology is still better than none at all.

JFK didn't "get away with it"--it all came out.

[Mia]

Hello everyone,

I merged all posts about this subject that were posted off-topic in another thread. You can now discuss this subject again without going off-topic

Regards,

Mia
Forum Moderator

[Libragirl]

I doubt William would do such a thing, on more than one occassion its been stated that he's terrified of making the wrong choice and having to get a divorce like his parents, he doesnt want to end up like them by making the same mistakes, he wants to do things right, it's one of the reason I think he dithers with Kate.

Charles said the same thing during his interview when he was invested as POW about making the wrong choice and he had to choose someone carefully because in his position she would one day be Queen and that was the last place he wanted his heart to be ruled by his head. Well he made the right choice unfortunately  between making that statement and marrying Diana he met and was totally manipulated by the Duchess of Deceit as a you tube member wrote during the Diana at thirty segment You may want to know what she called Charles.

[bpwriter47]

thanks mia!!